Lion77
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2025
- Threads
- 8
- Messages
- 225
- Reaction score
- 195
- Location
- United States
- Vehicle(s)
- 2024 Ranger Raptor
- Occupation
- Electrical Engineer
Well we know for sure now with all of the information above, including directly from the Ford Performance engineering, that you can tow with the Pro Cal installed.
Given that the RR is a truck...just like with the F-150 Raptor, it would make very little sense to do a Pro Cal but lose your ability to tow anything. From an ECU tuning standpoint, given that the Pro Cal is all software updates on timing / fueling / throttle mapping / shift points, there really isn't a reason that would prohibity them from towing in "tow mode".
Even if they needed to "de-tune" the 3.0L (which from the TFL test, they don't with the Pro Cal), that could be done in "tow mode" only, then give you the full power for everything else. It's all software managed now including drive by wire.
Even in the 90's and early 2k, most cars were still used cable-based throttle, so the user could force a WOT condition at low RPM's / high loads and lug the engine, all the engineers could do is manage timing and fueling, so the strategy was to dump a lot of fuel to prevent knock.
With drive by wire, you have "driver demand", which is what the pedal position is, but the ECU tuning is what determines how much the throttle body actually opens. So aside from break-in time periods, you can't really "lug" the engine as its not going to allow a throttle body position, timing and fueling condition that causes severe knock.
You can demand whatever you want, including WOT....the ECU will just give you finger and say piss off if the conditions don't allow, I'm only going 50% or whatever the max is under a given load condition. This isn't a bad thing, it's a good thing for long term reliability because it can prevent all kinds of dangerous conditions from existing.
Same thing with torque limiting. At this point, we know the ECU was tuned by Ford's engineering to torque limit. The Pro Cal does the same thing, but with a higher limit due to the added performance gains from no longer needing to account for fuel octanes below 91.
Clearly, they know the design and safety limits of the 10R60. We also know that even with the Pro Cal, the peak torque (IF you even make peak, which most of the time your not actually making the "ideal max"), is 536 lb-ft from the 3.0L, leaving a decent 10% safety margine on the 600 lb-ft max input torque.
On top of that, most towing is cruising at around 2,000-2,500 rpm. If you accelerate fast, the ECU will keep the engine RPM up in the 4k+ range. In both of those ranges, output torque is notably LESS than the "ideal peak" of 536. So, the average input torque the 10R60 is seeing even with the Pro Cal is around 400-475 lb-ft in the 2k range and 4k+ range where power is.
Looking at this real dyno graph from Steeda of their test rig 2024 RR, before the Pro Cal (stock) and after the Learn function on the Pro Cal had a week+ to "learn", you can see this reality:
And even up in the power band, as far as 3.0L output torque...it's about only 59 lb-ft difference from stock at the crank (using 14% drive train loss to back-calculate from WTQ to Crank TQ). 468 lb-ft vs. 409 lb-ft @ 4k RPM or 448 lb-ft vs. 409 lb-ft @ 4.5k RPM.
Like any engine, torque is going to continue to roll off as RPM increases, further lessening the peak input to the 10R60. And that's only at WOT, so shifting at 3.5K RPM under WOT...bet you the PCM won't allow it, but you can go WOT in a particular gear at 3.5k RPM, where it's handling static torque vs. transitional (i.e., the torque locks are already engaged, not engaging under torque).
FP could also potentially momentarily torque limit during lockup, then give you the full torque. Lots of things they can do ECU strategy wise to keep things reliable and I don't pretend to know them all in any detail, I'm just providing the general framework that shows they absolutely can and have tested it, some ways to accomplish that, irrespective of how they actually did. We just know that they did and you have full towing capability with the Pro Cal on the RR, which was the entire point of this thread.
As far as I am concerned, this has been fully hashed out probably in more detail than what most even wanted. But at least we know and can confidence.
Given that the RR is a truck...just like with the F-150 Raptor, it would make very little sense to do a Pro Cal but lose your ability to tow anything. From an ECU tuning standpoint, given that the Pro Cal is all software updates on timing / fueling / throttle mapping / shift points, there really isn't a reason that would prohibity them from towing in "tow mode".
Even if they needed to "de-tune" the 3.0L (which from the TFL test, they don't with the Pro Cal), that could be done in "tow mode" only, then give you the full power for everything else. It's all software managed now including drive by wire.
Even in the 90's and early 2k, most cars were still used cable-based throttle, so the user could force a WOT condition at low RPM's / high loads and lug the engine, all the engineers could do is manage timing and fueling, so the strategy was to dump a lot of fuel to prevent knock.
With drive by wire, you have "driver demand", which is what the pedal position is, but the ECU tuning is what determines how much the throttle body actually opens. So aside from break-in time periods, you can't really "lug" the engine as its not going to allow a throttle body position, timing and fueling condition that causes severe knock.
You can demand whatever you want, including WOT....the ECU will just give you finger and say piss off if the conditions don't allow, I'm only going 50% or whatever the max is under a given load condition. This isn't a bad thing, it's a good thing for long term reliability because it can prevent all kinds of dangerous conditions from existing.
Same thing with torque limiting. At this point, we know the ECU was tuned by Ford's engineering to torque limit. The Pro Cal does the same thing, but with a higher limit due to the added performance gains from no longer needing to account for fuel octanes below 91.
Clearly, they know the design and safety limits of the 10R60. We also know that even with the Pro Cal, the peak torque (IF you even make peak, which most of the time your not actually making the "ideal max"), is 536 lb-ft from the 3.0L, leaving a decent 10% safety margine on the 600 lb-ft max input torque.
On top of that, most towing is cruising at around 2,000-2,500 rpm. If you accelerate fast, the ECU will keep the engine RPM up in the 4k+ range. In both of those ranges, output torque is notably LESS than the "ideal peak" of 536. So, the average input torque the 10R60 is seeing even with the Pro Cal is around 400-475 lb-ft in the 2k range and 4k+ range where power is.
Looking at this real dyno graph from Steeda of their test rig 2024 RR, before the Pro Cal (stock) and after the Learn function on the Pro Cal had a week+ to "learn", you can see this reality:
And even up in the power band, as far as 3.0L output torque...it's about only 59 lb-ft difference from stock at the crank (using 14% drive train loss to back-calculate from WTQ to Crank TQ). 468 lb-ft vs. 409 lb-ft @ 4k RPM or 448 lb-ft vs. 409 lb-ft @ 4.5k RPM.
Like any engine, torque is going to continue to roll off as RPM increases, further lessening the peak input to the 10R60. And that's only at WOT, so shifting at 3.5K RPM under WOT...bet you the PCM won't allow it, but you can go WOT in a particular gear at 3.5k RPM, where it's handling static torque vs. transitional (i.e., the torque locks are already engaged, not engaging under torque).
FP could also potentially momentarily torque limit during lockup, then give you the full torque. Lots of things they can do ECU strategy wise to keep things reliable and I don't pretend to know them all in any detail, I'm just providing the general framework that shows they absolutely can and have tested it, some ways to accomplish that, irrespective of how they actually did. We just know that they did and you have full towing capability with the Pro Cal on the RR, which was the entire point of this thread.
As far as I am concerned, this has been fully hashed out probably in more detail than what most even wanted. But at least we know and can confidence.
Sponsored
Last edited:
